Boeing engineers begin vote on strike next week

Just when Boeing really needs its engineers, they're voting on whether to strike.
It's bad timing for Boeing. The aircraft maker is working around the clock to solve battery problems that have grounded its 787s around the world, and unionized engineers are a big part of that effort.
The vote begins Tuesday and runs through Feb. 19. The union has recommended that its members reject Boeing's contract proposal, hoping the company offers something better, or they may strike.
The strike threat is growing just as Boeing is dealing with a host of other problems. It must mollify airlines frustrated about buying a $200 million plane they can't fly, and it needs to fix the battery problem. U.S. regulators have launched an open-ended review of the 787's design and construction. And Boeing needs to speed production of the 787 and other planes.
Last month a battery on a parked 787 caught fire in Boston. Then on Jan. 16, another 787 had to make an emergency landing in Japan after another battery problem. All 50 787s that Boeing had delivered so far are grounded until the issue is solved.
Boeing has said that fixing the 787 is taking its full effort.
The effort includes hundreds of members of the Society of Professional Engineering Employees in Aerospace, the union's executive director, Ray Goforth, said in an interview on Wednesday. The union represents some 23,000 workers at Boeing.
Jim McNerney, Boeing Co.'s chairman and CEO, was asked on Wednesday whether a SPEEA strike would impact the investigation into the battery issues.
"I think we're going to have enough experts available to keep looking at this issue if it goes that far," McNerney said after the company reported financial results.
Goforth said the grounding ""shifted a lot of leverage to us." But workers wanted to keep things simple and not take advantage of Boeing's situation, he said, so they dropped the improvements they had been seeking in favor of extending the contract.
Boeing's counter-offer - the one the union will vote on - mostly does that. However, Boeing wants to drop traditional pensions for future hires, replacing them with 401k plans. Boeing also declined to make two changes that SPEEA wanted that it said would help preserve current retirement benefits. The union sees those as major give-backs that mean the offer should be rejected.
Boeing calls the proposed contract its "best and final offer."
The engineers and technical workers in SPEEA work on plans for new planes, as well as solving problems that arise on the factory floor. When a hole gets drilled a millimeter off, or a part is a little too big or too small, a SPEEA member figures out the fix.
The union believes a strike would shut down Boeing production lines in Everett, Wash., where its big planes are made, as well as Renton, Wash., where it cranks out more than one of its widely-used 737s every day. The factory-floor assembly work is done by the members of the International Association of Machinists.
Goforth believes a strike would also shut down Boeing's new, non-union plant in North Charleston, S.C., which makes 787s in addition to those assembled in Everett. That's because much of the engineering work on the South Carolina planes are done by SPEEA members in Washington, or who are flown in on assignment to South Carolina, he said.
Boeing isn't saying whether it would keep the plants running through a strike, but it has contingency plans. "We of course don't want a strike," spokesman Doug Alder Jr. said.
Labor strife has impacted the 787 before. The Machinists walked out in 2008, contributing to a three-and-a-half year delay in delivering the first 787. It was also one factor in Boeing opening the plant in South Carolina, where laws make it more difficult to unionize.
The Machinists approved a new, four-year contract in December 2011. Wall Street welcomed the labor peace, and Boeing shares jumped 12 percent in the month after the deal was announced.
Boeing has posted a profit of about $4 billion each in 2011 and 2012. In December it said it would boost its dividend to shareholders.
"Boeing's big problem, of course, is that it's doing well" and union members want to be rewarded, said Gary Chaison, a professor of industrial relations at Clark University.
Still, Chaison thinks a strike will be avoided. The things they're fighting over - pensions and other retiree benefits - can be negotiated, he said. And, with all the company's other issues right now, "Boeing wants this off the table."
It's bad timing for Boeing. The aircraft maker is working around the clock to solve battery problems that have grounded its 787s around the world, and unionized engineers are a big part of that effort.
The vote begins Tuesday and runs through Feb. 19. The union has recommended that its members reject Boeing's contract proposal, hoping the company offers something better, or they may strike.
The strike threat is growing just as Boeing is dealing with a host of other problems. It must mollify airlines frustrated about buying a $200 million plane they can't fly, and it needs to fix the battery problem. U.S. regulators have launched an open-ended review of the 787's design and construction. And Boeing needs to speed production of the 787 and other planes.
Last month a battery on a parked 787 caught fire in Boston. Then on Jan. 16, another 787 had to make an emergency landing in Japan after another battery problem. All 50 787s that Boeing had delivered so far are grounded until the issue is solved.
Boeing has said that fixing the 787 is taking its full effort.
The effort includes hundreds of members of the Society of Professional Engineering Employees in Aerospace, the union's executive director, Ray Goforth, said in an interview on Wednesday. The union represents some 23,000 workers at Boeing.
Jim McNerney, Boeing Co.'s chairman and CEO, was asked on Wednesday whether a SPEEA strike would impact the investigation into the battery issues.
"I think we're going to have enough experts available to keep looking at this issue if it goes that far," McNerney said after the company reported financial results.
Goforth said the grounding ""shifted a lot of leverage to us." But workers wanted to keep things simple and not take advantage of Boeing's situation, he said, so they dropped the improvements they had been seeking in favor of extending the contract.
Boeing's counter-offer - the one the union will vote on - mostly does that. However, Boeing wants to drop traditional pensions for future hires, replacing them with 401k plans. Boeing also declined to make two changes that SPEEA wanted that it said would help preserve current retirement benefits. The union sees those as major give-backs that mean the offer should be rejected.
Boeing calls the proposed contract its "best and final offer."
The engineers and technical workers in SPEEA work on plans for new planes, as well as solving problems that arise on the factory floor. When a hole gets drilled a millimeter off, or a part is a little too big or too small, a SPEEA member figures out the fix.
The union believes a strike would shut down Boeing production lines in Everett, Wash., where its big planes are made, as well as Renton, Wash., where it cranks out more than one of its widely-used 737s every day. The factory-floor assembly work is done by the members of the International Association of Machinists.
Goforth believes a strike would also shut down Boeing's new, non-union plant in North Charleston, S.C., which makes 787s in addition to those assembled in Everett. That's because much of the engineering work on the South Carolina planes are done by SPEEA members in Washington, or who are flown in on assignment to South Carolina, he said.
Boeing isn't saying whether it would keep the plants running through a strike, but it has contingency plans. "We of course don't want a strike," spokesman Doug Alder Jr. said.
Labor strife has impacted the 787 before. The Machinists walked out in 2008, contributing to a three-and-a-half year delay in delivering the first 787. It was also one factor in Boeing opening the plant in South Carolina, where laws make it more difficult to unionize.
The Machinists approved a new, four-year contract in December 2011. Wall Street welcomed the labor peace, and Boeing shares jumped 12 percent in the month after the deal was announced.
Boeing has posted a profit of about $4 billion each in 2011 and 2012. In December it said it would boost its dividend to shareholders.
"Boeing's big problem, of course, is that it's doing well" and union members want to be rewarded, said Gary Chaison, a professor of industrial relations at Clark University.
Still, Chaison thinks a strike will be avoided. The things they're fighting over - pensions and other retiree benefits - can be negotiated, he said. And, with all the company's other issues right now, "Boeing wants this off the table."
Hmmmm.....let's see. These "engineers" o.k'd faulty parts, designs, and batteries in Boeing's new "Dream"......and now they're threatening to go on strike for better pay and bennies? Really? Let them go, tell their union to shove it, and put some SMART people to work in their place instead. I am a building engineer by trade. If I screw up, and systems go down, I catch hell from my superiors, and from the building tenants. I don't get rewarded for bad performance by some time off and a better deal in the end. Wake up idiots. Our economy is hanging on by the same thread your JOBS are. One stupid move, and you're on a street corner holding a cardboard sign.
 @Harley-H.S.C. I don't agree with engineers going on strike, but they do not "ok faulty parts."  That's just a ridiculous statement.
Why not dump any retirement benefits program onto the taxpayer? It is my understanding that a Chicago government union is requesting such a move. [REF: Wall Street Journal] Interestingly many taxpayers live on their budgets. The senate has not passed a budget in more than three years.Â
 @George I'd rather we spend money bailing out workers then spend money bailing out corporations and handing over bonuses with my budget for their ill conceived games of OTC derivatives and Triple A scams. Wouldn't you?
These are the same wonderful union employees who specified the batteries on the 787? Wow, I wonder what that is going to cost.Â
 @oldster70 The jury is still out on that one. Until they establish root cause it is a little bit early to cast disparaging remarks towards anyone. One thing is certain the Boeing Engineering team and Machinists will play a large part in putting this problem behind them.
@al_wa Yes I bet they will. The sooner people forget the better (for the Engineering "team"). This was a colossal fu on their part. Oh and don't try pulling the machinists in to this mess. Engineering owns it along with operations.  Â
 @oldster70 I never said the machinists are part of the problem, I said they will be a part of the solution. The machinist on the flight line and in the factory will be working to test and replace a lot of batteries.
Boeing employees on strike, no way! A bunch of overpaid, lazy workers complaining once more.
It amazes me that those of you that are completely clueless have so mucn to say about what you think we should or should not be paid. We don't chastise your career choices. We just chose a better path.
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SPEEA isn't asking for any extras, they just want the same contract they are currently working under extended. Those of you that call us greedy think about the corporate entities at the top that sold out and outsourced the 787program thinking that they were going to "maximize" profits for themselves and their shareholders.. How did that work out for them? (The 787 is grounded indefinitly)  It wasn't our decision but you call us the greedy ones? The whole program is in the negative because of the decisions made at the top to outsource the program and has now cost the company 3X what it would have had they left it here to begin with!
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Profits are at record highs and we're now the #1 aircraft maker in the world again. Did the ivory tower guys do that or did the work force do it??Â
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God forbid if the Union(s) want to preserve what they have for future generations, I bet if your kids, brothers, sisters, grandkids, etc. ever decide to work there that you'll be happy we stuck up for their well being and their futures!
Just because you have decided to "settle" for less in your life and are happy with it doesn't mean you should chastise those of us who still believe in a better future for ourselves and our children.
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Your hot aired commentaries would be better spent at the state capital complaining about how the idiots you most likely voted in the last 30 years are screwing us with tolls, taxes, and their incompetence and greed.
 @Handsup70 I have two sons that work for Boeing that say the engineers couldn't find their butts with two hands and a road map, and cost the company more money in "down time" due to bad design than should ever be allowed. They stand around with their thumbs up their butts waiting for someone to fix SOMETHING so they can get back to work, and yet, get paid the whole time. It's a wonder Boeing isn't bankrupt.
 @Harley-H.S.C.  @Handsup70 Having two sons that work at Boeing doing what, clean the toilets? If your sons are MT-Manufacturing Technicians on the floor, you have nothing to brag about. That is where Boeing got the name the Lazy B, from lazy ass mechanics playing on their phones and computers. Get your facts before spouting off on something you have no clue as to what is going on.
 @Thomas Bagby  @Harley-H.S.C.  @Handsup70 The term Lazy B far predates either cellular telephones or computers in the shop areas; indeed computers in almost any area. There are several possible origins of the term but I can assure you that Boeing hourly employees as a whole are NOT lazy.
 @Harley-H.S.C.  @Handsup70 Depends on what engineers you or your son are referring to. Boeing has the finest aeronautical engineers in the world but also has some of the stupidest facilities engineers in the world. This is especially true in Everett.
Furd, I guess it would make sense that Everett would have more stupid engineers than Renton given the fact that Everett is just a little larger than Renton and has more engineers working there. I was at Everett in 2003, and I am in Renton NOW. Things HAVE changed. And by the way, Im not going to get into a pi#@ing match with you over proper grammer and spelling, but if you are going to point out other peoples mistakes, you might want to go back and edit some of your previous posts. It is pretty clear that you are no English major. This is my last communiction with you. Have a great day!
 @Dieseldog I didn't write that Renton had the best facilities engineers in 2003, just that they had less really stupid ones than did Everett. Things may have changed dramatically since that time. My personal opinion is that when looking for facilities engineers Boeing uses competitive testing and no one who scores higher than 25% is ever considered for the job. Harsh, I know, but such was my experience over the years.
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BTW, http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/stupidest
FURDÂ As long as your pointing out my spelling mistake, maybe you should know that "stupidest" is not a word. The proper way to say it is "most stupid" and as far as facilities engineers go, yes Everett has some bad ones for sure. I just transfered to Renton from Everett less than a year ago and if Renton had the best enginees in 2003, then they must have all retired.Â
 @Dieseldog It is "their" share and yes, indeed they do but nowhere near as many as Everett. I left Renton about this time in 2003 and spent my last two years in Everett. At that time there was no comparison, Everett was far worse.
Renton has there share too, believe me.
@Handsup70
"Did the ivory tower guys do that or did the work force do it??"
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SPEEA members certainly didn't make the decisions to build the 737 MAX or the 787, that was done by those ivory tower guys that decide the direction of the Boeing Company that will keep it in business for years to come. Give credit where credit is due. Outsourcing is absolutely necessary. The United States does not have the corner on all of the technologies necessary to build the 787.
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Look at the timeline for the 787 development and note the contributions made by Management, SPEEA and the Machinists Union.
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http://www.komonews.com/news/boeing/A-timeline-of-Boeings-787-Dreamliner-188352651.html
  @al_waÂ
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I'm more than happy to give them all the credit for the for "deciding" to go forth with the 787 and the 737 maxx.
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However, my comment was that they could have done a much better job at the developement, the execution, and the building process of the whole 787 and the ivory tower guys have actually "somewhat" admitted their process failures.
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My only other comment will be this... Should I give credit to Olympia for rebuilding the 520, the tunnel project and their gas tax/ toll pagkages too? I mean these are all great things that are sure to help the Washington infructure for years to come right? I guess the fact that they want more money due to their mistakes and poor decisions on said projects should transfer over to the tax payers right?
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My comparison is not totally off base... SPEEA and the IAM have only asked for things to stay the same.. Especially in years of record profits and once again becoming the #1 Aircraft maker in the WORLD!
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Boeing's plan is to divide and conquere the unions! A split on traditional pensions from new hires to senior employees would only be the beginning.
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Stick to your guns SPEEA!! You're not being unreasonable at all!
 @Handsup70 Excellent response, I completely agree.
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Spring must be in the air Boeing is going on strike again...
all you haters that don't work for Boeing or a union should just shut the front door. You have no idea what you are talking about. Move along, there is nothing here for you.
 @donner An Engineer that can't deal with opposing views?
 @al_wa  @donner Probably one of their engineers that can't.........engineer. I hear they get butthurt pretty easy.
This is...well...its just sad. Unions...in my mind are a bittersweet tragedy. I personally have only worked for a union once, and never again! I understand that it is the union that helps secure a higher wage and better health benefits, but we pay initiation fees, and dues, every week and for what?? I needed them to back me on something I thought was serious. A HEALTH concern that I took to management, and to the union. "If they fire you for this, call me, but there's nothing we can do for you now." ok...sucky, and disappointing but..ok. I got fired. The union did nothing. I went to the health department. People got fired. Thanks United Grocers!! :( How about that good folks at Hostess??? I see the union really stepped up to the plate on that one. Fought they"re greed to the point that all those people are without jobs, the company went bankrupt. Unions are a GOOD thing???????????? Boeing????????? Boeing's union????? You cant even fly your planes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Youve been grounded!!!!!!!! Doesn't that say something to all you workers????? Employees forced to not work..forced to give up theyre income, theyre whole life changes in hopes that someone elses greed will keep there greed growing. Where there is need...there will be greed.Â
 @firstlady27 Working FOR a labor union is totally different than working for an employer that has a contract WITH a labor union. If you don't know the difference you have nothing to add to the discussion.
You worked for a union?
I have read with disgust some of the commentary. What many of you do not realize is that the Engineer Union also raises the bar for all of the salaried employees. The deal Boeing has offered sucks big time. The union should have gone on strike back in November. We want the union to get what they want because the trickle down effect for the rest of us is a win-win.
 @lisamba09 No, that is incorrect. The Union DECREASES wages for everyone else. We end up compensating the greed of the Unions by way of a lesser salary and lower bonuses. The pool of available money becomes smaller as the Unions' becomes bigger. You obviously don't understand the true trickle down economics of a Corporation. Boeing is going to maintain a certain profit margin and they are NOT going to give more to the salaried employee's just because they were forced to give more to the Union Engineers. And engineer's bonuses and salary increases are based on the number of On Time Releases they have, which is easy to manipulate and has nothing to do with the QUALITY of the release. They could release a crap drawing and still have it be On Time despite needing revisions. The average increase for an Engineer is 4%, everyone else gets 2%. Do you really think the Engineers build that aircraft by themselves??? A truly pathetic and antiquated Business Model.
I am waiting for the day the board of directors realizes what a farce McNerney is and fires him. I hate that man with a passion. Driving down our stock and screwing the workers with his antiquited rules
As with professional sports, why in THE hell do people think just because the pie is big, they should be automatically entitled to a certain chunk of it?
It's a business's job to make as much money as they possibly can; likewise, that should NOT equte to that functioning as an automatic license to divvy it up ever so increasingly as profits climb.
If someone's making a good, above-average living - which they all are - that should be good enough.
Im not a SPEEA member, but I have to ask. Whats it to you what SPEEA members make and what they are asking for? Are you paying their wages? Â Are you as passionate about union governement employees being overpaid? The people whos saleries you DO PAY FOR? This is just another one of those " I dont get that so you shouldnt either" rants.
 @Throbbinhood you must be getting minimum wage, which is fine.Â
 @Throbbinhood Why shouldn't Boeing Engineers expect some of the profits. Look at professional athletes. The NHL players went on strike for more money and more profit sharing. I love it when everyone thinks we are greedy because the company made billions in profits. I didn't see any of the executives not getting compensated for a good year in business.
 @Thomas Bagby  @Throbbinhood If you buy stock in the company, then you can have a share of the profits... you see, this is how capitalism works. If you want socialism, then you should move to China, Russia or one of the many other lovely eastern bloc countries.
Because they ARE carrying themselves off as being entitled, and that perception rankles people to no end.
When one is already doing well - beyond that, the process can only be called one thing, and that IS greed - sorry...
Time to move more work to NC.
I hope everything gets resolved, when it comes down to it a job is a job 80% of the people at Boeing individually bring in more money each year than the national average house hold income... By a long shot, so what may seem like a raw deal could really be a whole lot worse...
Wake up union workers ........... pensions are a thing of the past. They hang on a corporation like an anchor in a highly competitive world market. Work your arse off and learn to live on less like the rest of the world.
Great idea! Everyone should just bend over and take it without fighting back just like Seattliteron.
It's been two years since the last Boeing strike... SURPRISE!
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Look when you get hired at the Lazy B Ranch, the union guys tell you right off "Start saving your money. The Contract [note: Contract is always with a capital C] is up on so-and-so date." The implication is that there is always ALWAYS something worth going on strike about.
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I wonder how that's working for all those guys in Detroit?
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I used to work for the catering company that had the Boeing Seattle contract. Like all contractors working onsite at a Boeing facility, we had to be a union shop. The Hotel Employees and Resturant Employees #9 union had the nerve to hit me with a $90 bill every month for a job that was 32 hours a week at less than $8 an hour. The medical and detal 'benefits' were great. I could visit a doctor for free is my arm fell off, but not before.Â
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About six months into my gig there, SPEEA was talking strike again and one of the engineers asked me if we were going to 'honor their strike'... I asked him if he would brown bag it if MY union went on strike. He gave me a funny look and moved on down the steam line... Yeah, I thought so, Sparky. Why don't you try that 'Look For The Union Label' speech somewhere else, k?
 @svensson Nothing but bitterness and contempt in your post. Maybe if you actually understood what was going on, it would make more sense to you. But, serving food, I can understand your lack of comprehension. Boeing is making Billions, that comes after millions, of cash. Why not share some with the actual people that work. And before you go off on another diatribe, without unions like IAM and SPEEA, workers would have been getting screwed over constantly. I suggest you think before you post.Â
@Thomas Bagby Oh, Tommy Boy, I have thought about it. I've thought about how many others in the area are adversely effected when the IAM decides they can't afford the payments on their second boat and decide to strike. How many subcontractor, service industry, supplier jobs are lost every time you guys decide to raid the pension fund for a cause you want sponsored in the legislature...
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We ARE talking about the same union umbrella [the Teamsters] that elected Jimmy Hoffa's kid as their president and has been linked to so much organized crime that it very nearly got hit with charges under the RICO statute [and would have had HillBilly Clinton not been President at the time].
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The fact is that unions are just as corrupt as the companies they protest and have been since about 1919. We're way past the 40 hour workweek and child labor laws, okay? Boeing has been slowly bugging out of Washington for 10 years and will continue to do so. I hope you like Carolina summers, cuz that's where your job is heading.
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Remember, stay union and buy Democrat.
@T_BONE_WALKER Odd, TBone. I was pretty sure that workers in Michigan and Ohio took that stance and it led to a mass exodus of major employers from both those states.
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Yes, during the '90s the Teamsters were almost indicted under the RICO statute for systematic pension fund fraud and political corruption, but the Justice Department under Bill Clinton's watch quashed it case. Look it up, if you like. Like any other organization, unions are made up of people. If the people are corrupt, so is the union. This is the same arguement that people make against corporations and Congress all the time, and so it stands to reason that the arguement would extend to unions, non-profits and other 'warm-fuzzy' organizations.
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I am not saying that unions in and of themselves are bad. Yes, I had a poor experience with three of them [HERE, SPEEA, and the WEA], but that does not mean that they have no role or no value. But the fact is that we Americans live in a consumer culture that feels it is our God-given right to buy the very best products at less than the cost it takes to produce them. Nobody would ever eat at a resturant if you the customer had to pay everyone involved in the production of your dinner [farmer, harvester, shipper, etc, etc, etc] a 'living wage'. A hamburger would run $40. Further, we no longer repair items, we junk them and buy new. Try to find a small engine repair shop or get a radio repaired, for example. Â
 @svensson The Teamster almost got hit with a RICO charge? When?
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The fact is there is no such thing as a corrupt union, just corrupt people in unions.
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Were so far past child labor laws that we still murder 11 fathers on the horizon deep water rig and 29 more fathers in upper branch Massey mine with willful negligence. No laws protected those families like the union miners are protected or union members performing dangerous duty.
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I think when it comes to unions and what the US workforce needs, you dont have any idea what you're talking about.
 @Thomas Bagby  @svensson Well, I just read through both posts. I think most people would agree that yours in the one that sounds bitter. Especially when you start talking down to people who aren't in the high and mighty airplane building business like you are. It's obvious why you will never be in upper management.
 @Scoondog  @Thomas Bagby  @svensson I would never want to be Scoondog. I was just posting what svensson could relate to and understand.
 @svensson Right on the money man. I couldn't agree more with your post.