Major Washington gun bill fails in state House
OLYMPIA, Wash. (AP) - A contentious proposal to expand background checks on Washington state gun sales failed Tuesday in the state House, where supporters said they were just a handful of votes short.
Rep. Jamie Pedersen, D-Seattle, had proposed a referendum clause that would have allowed the public to vote on the measure. He initially believed that was enough to corral the 50 votes needed to pass the bill but conceded Tuesday night that others had dropped their support.
"It was too big of a stretch for this year," Pedersen said.
Supporters of gun control had seen this year as the greatest chance for major changes in state law, with the public still reeling from the massacre of children at a Connecticut elementary school. The National Rifle Association, however, led a broad campaign in the state to block the bill, with opponents of the measure saying it wouldn't stop gun violence and arguing that it was the first step to a registry of gun owners.
Gun buyers currently must undergo a background check when they purchase a weapon from a federally licensed firearms dealer. Pedersen's proposal, crafted in conjunction with Republican Rep. Mike Hope, would have extended background checks to cover private gun transactions.
Hope, a Seattle police officer, had expressed concern that criminals are bypassing the current system of background checks and acquiring guns through private transactions. He said the proposal won't stop gun violence but would make it harder for criminals to get weapons.
Rep. Jamie Pedersen, D-Seattle, had proposed a referendum clause that would have allowed the public to vote on the measure. He initially believed that was enough to corral the 50 votes needed to pass the bill but conceded Tuesday night that others had dropped their support.
"It was too big of a stretch for this year," Pedersen said.
Supporters of gun control had seen this year as the greatest chance for major changes in state law, with the public still reeling from the massacre of children at a Connecticut elementary school. The National Rifle Association, however, led a broad campaign in the state to block the bill, with opponents of the measure saying it wouldn't stop gun violence and arguing that it was the first step to a registry of gun owners.
Gun buyers currently must undergo a background check when they purchase a weapon from a federally licensed firearms dealer. Pedersen's proposal, crafted in conjunction with Republican Rep. Mike Hope, would have extended background checks to cover private gun transactions.
Hope, a Seattle police officer, had expressed concern that criminals are bypassing the current system of background checks and acquiring guns through private transactions. He said the proposal won't stop gun violence but would make it harder for criminals to get weapons.
"It was too big of a stretch for this year" No, it is too big of a stretch forever.
"would have extended background checks to cover private gun transactions." Really? What else? What did the complete bill contain?
Proof positive that this was all about exploiting shooting victims for their emotional value to ram unpopular and unconstitutional gun control legislation down all our throats.
This is akin to MADD using DUI deaths to force legislation for ignition interlocks in EVERYONE'S car, pay higher insurance premiums and force you to carry a SR-22 filing just in case.
"It was too big of a stretch for this year," Pedersen said. Â <-- Sounds like they will be back.
"Supporters of gun control had seen this year as the greatest chance for major changes in state law, with the public still reeling from the massacre of children at a Connecticut elementary school." Â <-- They thought people would ride an emotional wave and not think? Â This shows you what politicians think of the public!Glad to see this knee jerk piss poor law fail, now lets focus on the real issues, mental health, mental health, and mental health, and lets get some real research on the side effects of these pyschotropic drugs that are handed out like candy to the masses since nearly every shooter in a mass shooting has been on at least one if not a handful of them at the same time!Â
Good riddance! My liberty is safe for the moment, at least.
I, too, am very glad to see this flawed legislation fail. Guns in the hands of legal gun owners are not the problem, in fact, if legal gun owners were disarmed the violent crime rate with ball pean hammers, baseball bats and etc. would increase. Home burglaries and home invasions would increase just as has happened in Great Britain, Australia and South Africa. Many countries, in fact, while having a lower death rate from guns, have a much higher violent crime rate. Scotland, for an example, has the highest violent crime rate in Europe since guns have been all but banished. I would much rather have the right to protect myself and my family from criminals and nut cases with a gun than get my brain scrambled with a hammer, only to sit in a wheelchair and drool all over myself for the rest of my life. I, personally, have had experience with criminals, both as an armed citizen and unarmed. From my experience, I can tell you for sure, I much prefer to be armed when confronted by a criminal. Â Â Â Â
@Geronimo Jones Some people just don't get it that your safety is your job not the governments. Society has been too babied for too long.
This bill was bad, it was a sneaky, underhanded attempt to ban all private sales in WA by requiring a background check for private sales and then making it impossible to actually GET the check.
This bill isn't dead yet, be watchful, they can vote to suspend the rules and bring it back anytime they want.
Everyone get on the phone to representative David Sawyer's office and ensure he stays opposed to this bill, he's wavering.
@NW-Economist Very true. No gun dealer would do a background check for $20, and the police really don't have a process for it. Universal background checks are a great idea, but this bill failed because it was too complex and tried to do too much, like set the price of a check and tell you where to get it done.
@Watcher3 The price is a catch-22. Too low and dealers won't do it. Too high and it becomes a burden to the seller/purchaser. Its just plain bad all the way around.
Fighting so hard to stop gun sales when they should put fear into people wanting to use them. Â Someone said 25 years to life, and that is a great start. Â Maybe they should put their time and effort into increasing punishment. Â What has happened with this country and actually disciplining those that break rules? Â
@SureHandz But if they did that, they'd have no excuse to try to take everyone's guns.
Glad to see it failed. Would have never have worked and would have just turned ordinary citizens into criminals. SHould do away with all background checks. All are unconstitutional. It assumes you're guilty and you have to pay for a background check to prove your innocent.Â
Pedersen said it was too big of a stretch this year. So he will try it next year? When will they learn that we will not stand and let then take away our second amendment rights away? Their ultimate goal is to take away our guns!
Glad to see the State House isn't filled with Hitler Youth like the State Senate is.Â
& the Vatican!
Amazing. Some folks in the legislature, I think, are sincere in their belief that these laws would somehow affect criminals. Others hate guns and want to regulate them out of existence. I can understand the haters. But I can't understand the ignorant, or foolish. Folks like seattleways. It's just mind boggling.
Presumption of innocence until proven guilty is a principle of this country. Not the other way around.
He said the proposal won't stop gun violence.
Well there you go. We know this won't work but at least we are DOING something.   You know MR. Hope, there are gun laws that do work. Like twenty-five to life for using a gun in a crime.
@Goodwin Oh stop Goodwin.  Just stop.Â
The purpose of the legislation is not to stop gun violence. Â It is one of several measures meant to reduce it. Â
But as the gun lover theory goes, we should NOT inconvenience criminals with a background check. Â We should NOT ensure people not suited to have a gun not have one.Â
That'd be crazy!!! Â We should instead have guns in every school, theater, county fair, and church. Â Because that's responsible! Â Duh! Â
@seattlewaysYou're the one who should stop. This bill wasn't about background checks, it was a sneaky, underhanded attempt to force total registration and ban all private sales. How? It said to get a private sale you needed to have a background check, but the only two ways it allowed to actually GET the check were found to be impossible during testimony on the bill during the House hearing on it.
Educate yourself and stop blathering WA Ceasefire's talking points.
@NW-Economist@seattleways"it was a sneaky, underhanded attempt to force total registration and ban all private sales"
The killer part is they don't even need to keep any info. They could have the people fill out the form, and then after the check, hand the form to the buyer/seller and keep nothing. But no, we can't have that. They have to enter data into the handgun database or whatever. If they dropped the sneaky registration nonsense and make it realistically feasible to do the check they would get their universal checks. But being what they are they always have to go for more than what they claim. If they want a bill requiring background checks then they need to limit it to just background checks and done in a practical manner. That would probably pass. At this point they are blocking themselves and I don't feel a bit sorry for them.
@seattleways @Goodwin the back ground check might have passed IF they agreed to destroy the imformation after it was checked. They didnt want to do that  they wanted to keep the info like a gun registery thats why it didnt pass
@seattleways @Goodwin It wouldn't reduce it. You think you can predict a crime that hasn't happened yet? You can't. A criminal isn't a criminal until they commit a crime. A psycho isn't on people's radar. Aurora and Sandy Hook are perfect examples. Â
Not only that, but their belief that criminals are sidestepping the system by buying via private transactions has no facts to support it. Where's the study done on criminals saying they bought from a law abiding citizen? They might have bought from a thug, that got some guns from someone that stole them though. Again, can't prevent it. A criminal is a criminal because they don't obey the law. This wouldn't change that.
In 1997, 70.62% of WA voters said "NO" to I-676 (the trigger lock initiative). Â I guess WA House members didn't feel lucky, did they. Â
@Opus8no5Â Â And all the NRA had to do was spend $2.3m on one crummy little state's initiative! Â In 1997! Â What's that in today's dollars. Â
Boy do those gun manufacturers get their money's worth. Â I imagine with the through the roof sales that they have properly lined the pockets of the NRA to take on any federal/state/local politician or state initiative that would make it ONE OUNCE harder for a criminal to get their hands on a weapon.
Those boys at the NRA are such cards!
How you describe the NRA is kinda what is done by the SIEU and other lefty unions..
@komoispropaganda   Dont forget the United Nations ! They qwant to diss arm the people of the USA
@seattleways Your yelling about the NRA and skipping over all the anti-gun lobbies. This is about HALF of the anti-gun lobbyists that pour money into anti-gun propaganda, and line the democrats pockets for favors.
Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence (BCPGV)
Coalition to Stop Gun Violence (CSGV)
The Educational Fund to End Handgun Violence (EFEHV)
The Violence Policy Center (VPC)
CeaseFire, Inc.
Americans for Gun Safety
Handgun-Free America, Inc.
Center for American Progress
Consumer Federation of America
HELP Network
Join Together
The American Jewish Congress
The Ford Foundation
The John D. and Catherine T. MacArthur Foundation
The Joyce Foundation
The David and Lucille Packard Foundation
Your glorious leader and his party are just as corrupt as the other side.
@Linc239Â Uh huh, because defending the rights of public workers to a working wage and benefits is SOOOOOOO very much the same as an organization hellbent on flooding the market with artillery. Â
Unbelievable you folks. Â You are all unreal! Â
@seattleways @Opus8no5Â
The NRA gets its political clout from membership and money, the same as the SEIU, AFL-CIO, NEA and AARP. Â
How much money was spent promoting the last state income tax putsch only to have the initiative fail miserably? Â Even Bill Gates' dad couldn't convince the voters. Â
@Opus8no5 @seattleways The NRA are the people if the USA . People with a voice no different than any other group.
You sure do make a lot of statements without knowing the facts. You are guessing a lot.
@Opus8no5 @seattleways Convenient argument and retort they've supplied you with.Â
If only it were true!!! Â What are the annual membership dues again for the 4m or so members? Â
And they pay Wayne LaPierre $1m+. Â I imagine their deputy director another $500k. Â And their CFO and the CIO and the COO. Â Once you get past the super stellar and talented executive management team, are the membership dues about run out? Â
Hmm....where do they get all the rest of that money to make their fancy ads, to lobby hundreds of members of state/federal governments, and to actually run their propaganda on our airwaves??? Â Hmm...I wonder!
@Opus8no5Â It ain't 1997 and this isn't a trigger lock initiative. Â
@seattleways @Opus8no5 \
It was about gun control and our legislators know where the voters stand on that based on I-676. Â Also, the window of opportunity for gun control as a result of Sandy Hook is closed or rapidly closing. Â
@armchairquaterback Election day is National Buy a Gun Day is it not? Arms dealers hadn't even recovered from that one yet! lol
@SeattleJoe @seattleways @Susabelle @Opus8no5 My CPL came from the police dept. it took 60 days it was a full back ground check
@gscott@seattleways"
The irony of that statement is delicious."
So true. Watching all the gullible anti-gunners react fearfully has almost become sport. If it were not for the dire consequences of somehow passing gun control measures that would disarm and endanger the people it would be a sport.
@seattleways@Susabelle@Opus8no5"Why the Puyallup (or other) gun show exhibition of course! Â DUH!"
The funniest part here is that this bs has been so refuted I'm surprised that even you would continue to post it. You are rapidly moving into troll-ville. If you are going to post lies you shouldn't pick something that is so incredibly easy to refute.
@armchairquaterback @Susabelle @seattleways @Opus8no5 There are around 278 million guns in the US that was from News Max 2 weeks a ago this is Y they want to register. Register the criminals there's less of them.
@ButtercupSprinkles Not quite accurate, WAC requires a current CPL which means you have had a background check. It is quite possible you could lose your gun rights, CPL is pulled, but still be a WAC member until next membership renewal. It isn't the same as a background check the day you buy the gun.
@seattleways  Guillible people react to fear.
The irony of that statement is delicious.
@Mike @seattleways @Susabelle @Opus8no5  Mike
Didnt know this  So whats all this BS flying around ???    Need to get this message out !
@Susabelle @seattleways @Opus8no5 there are so many guns out there that they could pass any law they want and a crook is still going to be able to buy a gun.  I think soimething like 600 000 000 guns are in the hands of the people  this law would only make it tougher for the law abiding
@Opus8no5 @seattleways In one speech Obama sold more guns than anyone in the history of the world !
@Susabelle @seattleways @Opus8no5 If the feds would just inforce the laws on the books right now that would be a good start. They complained that it costs too much money to inforce the laws. just look at immagration same thing...
@seattleways @Opus8no5 yep sadly I think your correct
Have you ever been to one of the WAC shows (Puyallup, as you call it)? To buy there, you must be a member. To be a member, you must pass a background check. Stop posting false information and supposition.
@seattleways @Susabelle @Opus8no5 News flash. The WAC gun shows require a WAC membership to buy a gun at them. The membership requires a background check.Â
Also, by "would-be criminal" do you mean someone who has not committed a crime yet but you think they might? Minority Report anyone?Â
@seattleways @Susabelle @Opus8no5 You can not buy a gun at the gun show in Puyallup unless you are a member of the Washington Arms Collectors. To become a member you first go through a back ground check you receive a badge with your name and #WAC number if you do not have a badge you can not buy a gun Just look.So you are misinformed.
@Susabelle @seattleways @Opus8no5 And all the politicians say this will not really stop the illegally purchasing.The Fn criminals are going to have more rights then you and me.
@seattleways @Susabelle @Opus8no5 Could you please cite me those statistics? I'm pretty sure I read that black market was supplying most of them with another large source being supplied by straw sales, in other words a person without a record buys for someone with a record........ Okay, explain again how this law is going to help again?
@Susabelle @seattleways @Opus8no5 Question of the day:
How does a would-be criminal get their hands on a gun?
Why the Puyallup (or other) gun show exhibition of course! Â DUH!
@Opus8no5 @seattleways Answer:  The NRA.
Gullible people react to fear. Â You stoke their fears and you create a hysteria. Â The hysteria in this case is this silly and farcical that the gubm't gonna get yo guns. Â So there is a huge run on ammo and guns. Â
HAHAHA. Â The sporadic buy back programs are drops in the bucket fella. Â No offense, but get with it. Â
@Opus8no5 @seattleways LOL, Obama is now known as the best gun salesman of all time! LOL
@seattleways @Opus8no5Â
Who is responsible for the unprecedented nationwide gun-buying spree, including here in WA, that has left manufacturers of guns and ammunition with huge backlogs? Â The NRA or the politicians threatening gun control legislation? Â Need a hint? Â
@seattleways @Opus8no5 Oh for heavens sake! they are not buying their weapons over the counter!!! They are purchasing them illegally!
@Opus8no5 @seattleways Yes, look at the polls.  Not an insurmountable deficit for the NRA to overcome, but it won't be a walk in the park to continue allowing criminals to purchase guns over the counter willy nilly.  It'll take some investing and some good old fashioned misinformation campaigns!  They'll do it!
@Opus8no5 I read the story; this didn't seem to be about a trigger lock initiative.
@tufa23Â @Opus8no5Â Are you really that obtuse?
@70MonteCarlo @tufa23 @Opus8no5 Yes, yes he is.