Ken Schram: Boeing should lead on same-sex issues
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Boeing, once again, needs to take a leadership role.
The world's largest producer of airplanes appears very reticent when it comes to providing married gay couples with survivor pension benefits.
The point raised by Boeing is that pensions come under federal regulations and the federal government doesn't recognize same-sex marriage laws.
I find that to be an odd stance for Boeing to take.
That's because Boeing has long been one of the companies to take the point when it came to providing benefits to same-sex couples.
The issue of pension benefits has come up during negotiations between Boeing and SPEEA, the engineering union that represents more than 20,000 Boeing employees.
The marriage equality law passed here in Washington - which goes into effect early next month - does not address pension benefits, an issue that has not been formally introduced into the negotiations.
But it's a natural.
If a heterosexual spouse is entitled to those benefits, why wouldn't a gay spouse?
There's nothing to prevent Boeing from such inclusion and I think it is a weak position to try to hide behind federal regulations that, at some point, will have to catch up to state laws.
As noted, it's time for Boeing to once again take a leadership role.
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Have something to say to Ken? Login or signup below to post a comment. Just be sure to read the rules and keep things civil. You can also e-mail him at kenschram@komo4news.com. You can also connect with Ken on Facebook.
The world's largest producer of airplanes appears very reticent when it comes to providing married gay couples with survivor pension benefits.
The point raised by Boeing is that pensions come under federal regulations and the federal government doesn't recognize same-sex marriage laws.
I find that to be an odd stance for Boeing to take.
That's because Boeing has long been one of the companies to take the point when it came to providing benefits to same-sex couples.
The issue of pension benefits has come up during negotiations between Boeing and SPEEA, the engineering union that represents more than 20,000 Boeing employees.
The marriage equality law passed here in Washington - which goes into effect early next month - does not address pension benefits, an issue that has not been formally introduced into the negotiations.
But it's a natural.
If a heterosexual spouse is entitled to those benefits, why wouldn't a gay spouse?
There's nothing to prevent Boeing from such inclusion and I think it is a weak position to try to hide behind federal regulations that, at some point, will have to catch up to state laws.
As noted, it's time for Boeing to once again take a leadership role.
---
Have something to say to Ken? Login or signup below to post a comment. Just be sure to read the rules and keep things civil. You can also e-mail him at kenschram@komo4news.com. You can also connect with Ken on Facebook.
First off this just got voted on and couples are not yet getting married. I've heard of putting the cart before the horse, but this one is right down rediculous. Boeing is a private owned company and maybe it's time to let them run their own business for a change. The federal law is still what it is and until that changes (if it does) some of these changes aren't going to happen like it or not.
Boeing is in the aircraft building business not the sex business
Like Ken really gives a rat's rear end about any of these comments. I'm amazed he gets paid to stir the pot.
  @What-the-HeckÂ
Its not stirring the pot, people are outing him for being ignorant.
Ken are you telling Boeing to rebel against our government? To not adhere to federal law? The ones that need to "take the lead" on same sex issues are the people themselves. Only then will policies change. It's the people not big business or even government. Once the people lead the rest will follow.
@Barlion follow the hostess down the path?
 @jennieb  @Barlion American greed and same sex issues together? Love it.
Just find it strange that worldwide (that means, then entire world) that Boeing has been giving same sex couples benefits for insurance, etc for years (that means more than just recently) and not had a problem with it. BUT put the words "same sex MARRIED couples" together and now "we can't do it because it's against federal law" comes out. Hmmmmm. Weird.
 @UtterReality I agree with you to a point. You should and or understand that most countrries right now are voting for being caught gay to be capital punishment. (Meaning death) While I understand your place you might want to think about where your at.  This is a world concept your fighting. It will not happen in one day
How about they just drop the outdated pension plans altogether, and give employees a 401K like everyone else? Â That way gay couples can will their retirement funds to whoever they want - or even transfer the funds before their death.
 @UtterReality  I agree with you to a point. You should and or understand that most countrries right now are voting for being caught gay to be capital punishment. (Meaning death) While I understand your place you might want to think about where your at.  This is a world concept your fighting. It will not happen in one day
 @TheBronze @UtterReality That is what Boeing was trying to do, but the Unions reject it!
@TheBronze @UtterReality
Forgot to mention, they have a 401K plan too............They have the best of both worlds and cry over both of them.Â
@jennieb
Hmm, not sure about Federal employees. Im in a govt pension plan where I have to contribute to both my pension and 401K. Basically 15% of my check goes to those plans. So its not free for me.
@tmanch Oh, you mean like Federal employees? who get both retirement pensions AND matching 401"s? where is the taxpayer outrage?  oops,  i forgot - Federal workers are unionized.Â
Fricken Yawn!
I cant believe people actually get their blood pressure up and stir hatred over something that is completely unimportant in the grand scheme of things. As if their lives will be ruined. Civilization making the same mistakes in different scenarios. Salem Witch Trials just to ring a bell. Without the brutality of course.
So Ken, just why should Boeing, or any other corporation provide support for your bu# buddy friends? THEY BUILD AIRPLANES you idiot, supporting minority leftwing politics is best LEFT to âcommentatorsâ such as yourself.Â
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BOEING should not have to do anything that the law does not require!
 @maggie112 Does the law require them to give those particular benefits to heterosexual married couples? If so, in the state of Washington, it seems they should have to either stop giving them to straight married couples, or allow it for all couples who are married in the state. Seems like a pretty simple solution to me.
I don't get it, why does Boeing need to lead the charge in domestic partners for Washington State, itâs corporate headquarters are not in this state any more? Doesn't this state have other employers to lead on this or is Schram just wanting to give a black eye to Boeing for personal reasons instead of the State who probably has the same antiquated policies in place along with other businesses around the south sound? Seriously, we just passed the
referendum and now he wants HR policies for a major fortune 500 company to change in two plus weeks, it's not going to happen.
I remember reading many, many posts on KOMO about how gay marriage in WA was supposed to be all about equal rights for those of same sex wanting something as simple as getting married, and "not about money".
Now it appears that not only it is about money, but about other people's money.
I'm so glad that I don't have a huge, successful buisness that unions, gov't and other greedy people move in on and take over.
 @SgtPepperSpray If, as the common argument goes, all those same sex couples with the same rights as straight people, were to marry opposite sex partners-would this be an issue? If not, why is it an issue in a state where the people voted to allow same sex couples the right to marry?
Ken, how about you pay those benefits to the Partners. What is KOMO"s pension plan? Yes, the FED does have rules on Pension benefits. How about Boeing give surviving partners free marijuana. Everyone is so free with other peoples or businesses money.Â
Buy term insurance if you are so worried about your partner. The days of pensions are disappearing and there are those who want to take advantage of it while its still there. BE HAPPY. If Im correct, the Boeing pension is basically free w/o employee contribution. Please let me know if that changed.Â
 @tmanch I agree with you, term Life insurance is a good idea.You might be better off in the long run if the policy is a high dollar amount.
The fed, IRS and the rest of the world do not recognize same sex marriages. Let's boycott all business that do not accept gay marriages. Let's bomb the Middle East because they do not believe in gay marriages. Let's burn all churches and destroy all religions because they do not believe in gay marriages. It's either the gay way or the highway. It's the law in Washington State now. Best of luck.
 @STK You have discovered our plan. I would write more but, I have to go convert some kids down at the local middle school.  Jeeze...
 @STK too late for that and im sure we Washingtonians will be seeing more in r prefer view then in our old saying get a room!
Suppose Boeing goes bust. Hey, it happens. The retirement benefits are then administered by the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation. That U.S. government agency will cover your payments up to a maximum level that's based on your age and accrued benefits when the pension failed.
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So, if Boeing promises same sex married couples retirement benefits that are forbidden by federal law because of DOMA, and Boeing goes bust, what happens?
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I think Boeing and all national companies need these answers before making promises that may not be kept. I don't for a min. think that Boeing is being unfair or evil. They just need consistent rules to follow.
Well if the states where Boeing has a plant do not all recognize such couples they are simply using that as an excuse to not change such a policy her in WA where we approved to recognize such things. They'll likely change their tune if they get sued which you can bet dollars to donuts lawyers are already hunting as the sharks smell blood in the water.
@Freespeech the problem is that you can't change HR policies just because a state passed a law on the 8th of November which has been less then a month.Â
OMG can someone tell me when the Twinkie is coming back?
Likely never. Someone will cite the health risks and they will be forever banned in the name of wholesome food - i'm sure the sugar, fat, and preservative police are on it.
@jennieb Either that or someone will say that it looks like a phallic symbol and it can turn people gay. *sarcasm alert*
 @The WA Mama  @jennieb Great, then we'll have to also ban SnoBalls®, because they look like a pair of boobies.Â
who is Ken Schram to dictate the business practices of a company? really. and WA residents wonder why it is that businesses are leaving the state and in some cases the country. The collective "we" are going to be so politically correct that there will eventually be few issues left for political correctness.   We have to ask ourselves why it is that companies outsource abroad, reduce hours and benefits, work with fewer employees - if they are hiring at all.Â
@jennieb Get real. He's offering an opinion, which is what he's paid to do, not dictating anything. You don't have to agree, but show some awareness of what's being said.
unfortunately we just passed R 74 and it's been less than three weeks companies are not going to change policies part way through their fiscal year, they are going to wait.Â
And what is their union saying? Â Is their union pushing hard for their gay members to get these pension benefits? Â Honest question because I don't know. Â Easy to point the finger at Boeing, but knowing what their union's position is on this is equally important right? Â
I agree that the benefits belong to the surviving spouse regardless of if it is a same-sex relationship or not. If they are employed in a state that recognizes same-sex marriage then by law they shouldn't be denied those benefits. To deny the spouse's what is rightfully theirs will open Boeing up to a slew of lawsuits.
this wasn't an issue till three weeks ago when we passed the law and now it's not fair. yeah right!
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Ken, its pretty simple, and your wrong as usual. Boeing is a Federal supplier of weapons, aircraft, software and many other items. Also a worldwide supplier of the same goods. As such, Â they have to adhere to Federal policy. This is not discrimination in any way. Washington state can pass any policy and law they want. Since Boeing headquarters is in Chicago (Not Washington state anymore) they control the vertical and horizontal.
Not only that but Boeing can't just change policy three weeks after Washington State passes a law to make gay marriage legal.Â
 @Ringmaster2000 It is, theyre hiding behind a curtain of technicality.
 @IMHO Is that the same technicality that would see the feds put me in jail even though I-502 says marijuana is OK now?
Â
I don't disagree with the sentiment that same sex couples should enjoy the same survivors benefits and entitlements that the rest of us enjoy. Until federal regulations are amended to include all couples, regardless or sexual orientation, which rule book do you follow?
Â
Mike
no it means that you can't change a policy in three weeks after we vote for a law.
People who are for gay marriage will take same stance. People who oppose gay marriage will leave responses, such as these ones here. Nothing new but narrow minds.
 @IMHO Or like me, who don't give a ish one way or another.
@IMHO Correct.
#1.)Â Well Ken, I say it's time for you to just come out of the closet
#2.)Â Â Private Company
#3.)Â Dismantle your soap box.
@Sydthepiper Actually, they are a public company, as in anyone can buy shares at a given price and availability.
 @Ameso ....semantics, but point accepted....(but you know what I meant).
 @Sydthepiper None of us are mind readers so how could we possibly know what you might mean?